i have to tell you i've worked in education for several years and as you know "sesame street" and a lot of the programming on pbs is the gold standard not just here in america but around the world for educational programming and for young people, for children. so i mean if you want to talk about somebody who doesn't understand america, suggesting that cutting that is not, should not be a priority to keep it, i don't understand that. i really don't. >> how do you think president obama has played it? i mean, it's a serious issue. >> yeah. >> god forbid if pbs were to get cut like that because of the educational programs they give our young people in this country. but he has used it in a different way, not serious, but almost in a joking fashion, you know, somebody is after big bird now. does that play well? >> i think it does because it's a very quick, memorable way for people to remember that what we're talking about here, the math doesn't add up. it goes to a much larger serious point. obviously pbs is very important but here you have mitt romney saying, i mean it is a $5 trillion hole.